Parenting The Socially Phobic and Avoidant Adult
SEASON
1
EPISODE
4

School Phobia, Avoidant Personality, Learning Disability: From School Refusal to a Graduate Degree

David describes his struggles with learning disabilities, social anxiety, avoidance, and dependence within a loving, close-knit family. His journey took him from hiding in his college dorm room, depressed and socially isolated, to earning an advanced degree and developing a successful career and social life.
Episode Overview

What This Episode Is About

“David” describes growing up with dyslexia and a fine-motor coordination disability and the profound effect these challenges had on his confidence, education, and social development. Negative school experiences contributed to anxiety, avoidance, dependence, and eventually severe school phobia. His difficulties continued into college, where isolation and avoidance threatened his ability to function independently. David discusses the gradual process of understanding his learning disabilities, confronting anxiety, reducing avoidance, and separating from the emotional and financial dependence he had developed on his parents. Although new challenges continued to produce anxiety, he learned to function despite it rather than retreat from it. His journey ultimately took him from school refusal and social isolation to earning a graduate degree and supervising a team of caseworkers, demonstrating a dramatic change in both professional responsibility and personal independence.
At a Glance

This podcast is best for:

Parents, concerned adults, and professionals supporting adult children who struggle with social anxiety and avoidance.

Episode Details:

13
 min, 
19
 sec
April 30, 2024
Full Transcript

This episode's transcript:

[00:00:00]
I would like to introduce you to someone. His name is David. He has been a patient of mine, and now I see him for some maintenance work once a month. He has a very interesting story to tell. And keeping in mind that fear of speaking in front of groups is the number one phobia in this country. Let’s give him a little round of applause as he comes up. APPLAUSE This never gets any easier public speaking, but I’m actually doing it. So you’ll have to bear with me if I stumble over a few words. So I was born with a fine motor coordination disability and a dyslexia. And I wasn’t really aware of what the disability meant to me until I was about in the sixth grade.
[00:00:51]
I went to Yeshiva, which is private school. And the reason why I went there is it was important to my parents. It was important to me. But I really didn’t get any help in terms of my learning disabilities. And I really didn’t understand that I had their learning disabilities then. I had teachers working with me, explaining to me, this is how you write cursive or something like that. I remember the thing that will stick out with me until the day I die is my first grade Hebrew teacher yelling at me for the way that my handwriting was. And that’s one of the ways that my disability became, you know, showed itself in school. I went through elementary school with really no problem socially. Then I went to junior high school, again to Yeshiva. And I had a little bit more problems there, because it was a lot bigger.
[00:01:43]
And I kind of got lost in the equation. Again, no really help from my learning disabilities at all struggling, you know, C work. Had my parents, you know, nudging me, why don’t you do your homework instead of watching TV or playing ball. And I got very upset. I wouldn’t say I was depressed yet. I then transferred to public school where I did very well. I did about B/B+ work. And I think it was there that I first discovered that I have, you know, some people called it being really shy. I didn’t really talk to anyone. I felt very out of place. You know, it was not my thing. I had some friends in my other school, and I left them behind. And just felt very lonely and very isolated.
[00:02:33]
I stayed in my room a lot of times. You know, TV was my best friend. The TV and computer games was, that was my two best friends. And I then transferred back to Yeshiva and I graduated. And then my life got very interesting after that. About 10 years ago, I went to the University of Bridgeport in Connecticut. And the reason why I went there was because my parents really thought that it would be good for me to get away from home, because I was very dependent on them. There I grew up in a very loving, nurturing family. You know, my parents gave me all the love and support for myself and my three brothers. And it was just fantastic to grow up in probably too much. Sorry, Mom.
[00:03:23]
So I was sent away to school. And I actually, the first couple of days, I actually did go to classes. And I felt very uncomfortable. I felt like people were staring at me. No one was, you know, everyone had their eyes on me. It doesn’t matter what I was doing. And then, and this is probably because I had very low self-esteem, because I really didn’t succeed in school at all. Because of the learning disability, I didn’t get the proper help that I needed. I then, the fourth day of school, I decided I’m not going to classes anymore. There’s a TV in my dorm room. You know, there are a lot of good talk shows on. I’m going to sit in my room and watch TV and eat and eat. And just be miserable. And, you know, make up stories to my teachers, to my professors, you know, tell my parents that everything’s going OK.
[00:04:16]
Yes, I’m going to classes. Yes, I failed the test, but I’ll study hard. I turned in this paper. Can you help me with this? And that lasted a bunch, I think, nine weeks. And it was Halloween where my parents came up and picked me and said, you know, basically, you failed out of school. I was then referred to another therapist that I had seen when I was younger. And I basically, I lied to her about what I was doing. I went to, I did an odd job in between. And I then went to Nassau Community College. And I had another very interesting experience there. We were talking about credit cards and being inventive. And my father actually put $500 in my ATM.
[00:05:06]
I had an ATM that I could use. And I used it very well. I went back and forth to Manhattan. I went to Roosevelt Field. I saw just about every movie that was out in 1988. You know, I went to Manhattan, played in the game room at Penn Station. I had a great time. You know, went to pizza, went for hamburgers. You know, I was having the best time in my life then. Of course, my parents find out that I wasn’t going to classes there either. It’s there where I met Jonathan. And my first image of Jonathan was that I was, to be honest with you, I was scared of him. I didn’t go willingly. I believe my father made the phone call to him. And I remember vividly when we went. And he was a very intimidating person. And I really didn’t know exactly what was wrong with me.
[00:05:58]
Why was I afraid of people? I was afraid of myself. I really liked staying in my room, not really going out at all. And just being to myself, and I really thought everyone was looking at me. No socializing at all. I went to human resources. And that was probably the low point of my life. Because I was told by a counselor that you have a learning disability, and you’re never going to graduate college. So you just try and find something else to do. And I don’t know if this woman probably did some good because she inspired me. And with going to therapy, I then went to Suffolk Community College, where my mother teaches. And I took a class, two classes.
[00:06:49]
I got two A’s. And I got a little confidence. And I still was not really socializing. My mother was a professor there. And I stayed most of the time in her office. Being friendly with her friends because they were older. And they weren’t as threatening as the younger people. And I went there. I graduated. And I fell in love with my first girlfriend. And I met her through a personal ad. And that relationship lasted about eight months. And it was a really good experience for me. I was seeing Jonathan at the time. I was involved in group therapy. It was gaining confidence in myself. And then when that relationship fell apart, I had said to myself, and your children may say the same things to themselves, that, well, all I need is a relationship. Or all I need is a job.
[00:07:39]
Or all I need is this or not. I need this one thing to be the complete equation of my life. Well, that wasn’t exactly right. After that relationship failed, I kind of went back to my old behavior. I still went to classes. But I was going to a Adelphi University at the time. And I transferred. And I still cut a lot of classes, still avoided everyone. My social skills were not great. They were a little bit better. I started taking some communications courses and doing some public speaking. And I felt a little bit better about myself. Of course, I was going to school. I was making something of myself. And I really, I had the learning disability help at the time. But I said, I didn’t get it in high school. Why am I going to get it in college? I’m going to do it on my own.
[00:08:30]
And my parents were very supportive. Again, maybe even too supportive. My father and my mother, to a lesser role, did a lot of my working college for me. My father was in the banking world. And he had a lot of downtime in his job. And I took some history courses. My father loves history. So he got some very good grades for me. I’m very happy to say. But he did a lot of my work in college. And my mother did the typing for my papers. So I had basically had easy. I just showed up to the classes when I felt like it. And a piece of cake. My father doing the papers. My mother typing the papers. All I had to do was go to class when I felt like it. My social skills started to get a little bit better again.
[00:09:22]
I started to go to parties. But feeling very uncomfortable. Standing kind of like in the background. Going, forcing myself to go. Because that’s what Jonathan and I had discussed. And he didn’t say, I’m going to monitor you and make sure that you go. But it was up to me. It was my choice to go. And I went on some singles weekends. And basically just being very quiet, staying in the back. But all the while, I guess, gaining a little bit more confidence and a little bit more confidence. I graduated Delphi University in 1983 with a BS in the elementary education. And I substitute taught for two years. And it was a very frustrating thing. It was a very anxiety-ridden thing.
[00:10:12]
Because we’re going into different schools all the time. And this is something that I explored with Jonathan, how I didn’t have any control of the classes. And I had a major anxiety. No, my hands would sweat. My underarms would sweat. And it was just very nerve-wracking. But somehow I managed to do it. Yeah, there was still little avoidance with me. I mean, that’s one of the big things that has plagued me. Since I’ve discovered my problems, is that I’ve avoided things. And now that I’m here today, obviously, I’ve cut down on that significantly. I would hope. I finally moved out of my parents home. I moved into the city with my brother. Because I thought it’d be good to cut the strings. Because my parents all along were very, very supportive. I was financially dependent, emotionally dependent. And any other way you could think of, I was dependent on my parents and on my family.
[00:11:05]
I moved into the city. And it was just, I thought it would be very good for me. It turned out not to be so good for me. It just basically, I was subbing. And I stayed in my apartment the whole time watching TV. I got very, I started watching Jerry Springer even before it was popular now. So right now, as of today, I’m supervising seven people, seven case workers, and people coming to me for answers. And it still, it’s a very anxiety-ridden position, because you’re one step away from making the wrong decision. But it feels good that I’m in a place of power. And that I’m not the same person that I was when I first saw this man. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
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Meet the Speaker

Jonathan Berent, LCSW

Psychotherapist & Author — Social Anxiety and Performance Anxiety

Jonathan Berent, L.C.S.W., A.C.S.W., is a psychotherapist who has been practicing since 1978. He has created the Berent Treatment Method for Social Anxiety, which is the result of his clinical work with thousands of individuals of all ages with social anxiety since 1978. He has extensive clinical experience with avoidance and dependance personality disorder, and is the author of Work Makes Me Nervous: Overcome Anxiety and Build the Confidence to Succeed (Wiley, 2010), Beyond Shyness: How to Conquer Social Anxieties (Simon & Schuster, 1992), and Social Anxiety: The Untold Story, which is a training course for mental health professionals in using the Berent Method to treat social anxiety. (Andrew Kukes Foundation, 2011).
SocialAnxiety.com, has served millions of unique visitors as a multimedia clearinghouse for patients, parents, and fellow mental health professionals in search of articles, educational materials, and books on social anxiety and related subjects. His library of clinical interviews appears to be the most documented clinical success with social anxiety.

Guest Speaker

Frequently Asked Questions

Common Questions About Social Anxiety Treatment

Yes. The clinical interviews at www.social-anxiety.com are evidence of this. Long-standing social anxiety and avoidance can become deeply ingrained, but meaningful change is still possible. It takes hard work. When adult children are phobic and avoidant they lack initiative for their mental health. Parents need to learn a therapeutic strategy to compensate for this. Treatment needs to address the individual’s specific patterns of anxiety, avoidance, emotional regulation, dependence, relationships, and functioning rather than assuming that the problem is permanent because it began in childhood.

It’s like putting money in the bank. The investment in avoidance accrues with time. Avoidance produces immediate relief from anxiety. That relief teaches the person that escaping or avoiding the situation was necessary, making avoidance more likely the next time anxiety occurs. Avoidance can become an addiction and a compulsion. As this cycle continues, the person’s world can become progressively smaller and dependence on family members can increase.

Yes. Perfectionism is OCPD; obsessive compulsive personality disorder. An adult child may avoid applying for jobs, pursuing education, dating, or trying unfamiliar activities because of an intense fear of failure, criticism, embarrassment, or not performing perfectly. Avoiding the situation can feel safer than risking an imperfect outcome, but this can significantly interfere with adult development.

Yes, but methodically. Simply forcing an adult child into feared situations can increase conflict and resistance but continually protecting them from discomfort can reinforce avoidance. The goal is to help the person develop the ability to tolerate anxiety and take meaningful steps toward functioning rather than either eliminating all discomfort or demanding immediate independence.

The Berent Method. Effective treatment needs to address specific factors preventing the adult child from functioning independently. These may include social anxiety, avoidance, fear of failure, perfectionism, depression, emotional regulation, relationships, dependence, and family dynamics. Treatment should ultimately produce meaningful changes in everyday functioning, as well as reducing anxiety symptoms. It is common that therapists do not know how to, and will not work with, parents of adults over eighteen years of age.

Take the Next Step

You Do Not Have to Manage This Alone

Public speaking anxiety, performance anxiety, and social anxiety respond to treatment. If this episode described your experience, a conversation is the great next step.