Public Speaking Anxiety & Fear of Being Noticeably Nervous: Mind Surgery for High Performers

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7 Figure Salesman Addresses Performance Anxiety

Ray, a seven-figure salesman in an intensely competitive industry, describes overcoming severe performance and public speaking anxiety. His treatment addressed embarrassment, shame, unresolved anger, and rage, helping him progress from anxiety and depression that kept him in bed to significant career advancement and improved personal relationships.

Episode Overview

What This Episode Is About

“Ray,” a highly successful salesman working in an extremely competitive industry, discusses his battle with severe performance anxiety and fear of public speaking. At the beginning of treatment, anxiety and depression had become so intense that there were mornings when he struggled to get out of bed. His deeper core work involved confronting embarrassment, shame, unresolved anger, and rage that had remained active beneath the surface of his performance problems. As treatment progressed, Ray developed what Jonathan Berent describes as a “high-performance mind”—the ability to respond to pressure with greater confidence, emotional control, and flexibility. Professionally, he reports reaching approximately 96 percent of his annual sales quota during an especially difficult business environment and describes finding ways to succeed while others were struggling. He also discusses significant improvements in his personal life. His experience illustrates how addressing emotional issues beneath performance anxiety can influence career advancement, resilience, relationships, and overall functioning.

At a Glance

This podcast is best for:

CEOs, executives, clinicians, attorneys, students and performers whose careers depend on speaking — and who have found that competence alone did not resolve the fear.

Episode Details:

min,

sec

July 8, 2025

Full Transcript

This episode's transcript:

[00:00:00]

I’m on the phone with Ray from the West Coast. Thank you for sharing and as I say when I do most of these interviews This is going to be a very compelling story just for a little bit of a background Ray is a very successful salesman in an extremely competitive industry as well as being a dedicated family man and getting right to the point to the present in this recent In a recent session you shared that you reached about 96% of your sales quota for the year. That’s impressive You also said something very interesting when everyone else was floundering. I found a way to win and I believe this statement is a result of what I reference often as a high performance mind Which is certainly it wasn’t there at the beginning of our treatment. Can you please give some details about this phenomenon?

[00:00:55]

sure I guess you know the way I’d approach it is, you know I’ve gotten to point in my career and in my personal life where I feel you know very confident in my abilities my strengths and with the right amount of effort I’m capable of doing great things and You know as you mentioned I do work in a very stressful environment with lots of pressure to perform on multiple levels I’m dealing with large transactions that are very complex and evolved and take several months to even years to complete I’ve been able to stay focused and to maintain control of things that I can control to do the best that I can do to impact those things that are You know sometimes out of my control and to continuously move forward through these complex transactions with a clear head and a sense of purpose and direction so I think that you know The way that I’ve accomplished these things is in working with you To get you know first and foremost, you know an understanding of you know What is the physiology behind you know what was causing my anxieties in the first place?

[00:02:06]

and learning exactly what was occurring in my mind and the effect that it was having on me physically Was really helpful in learning how to control it and you know it’s been really helpful for me An important for me to develop my mind and body to handle these high pressure situations and learn how to control the adrenaline To leverage it is a good thing. So you know today. I look at myself as a leader I look at myself as someone who’s got a successful track record And you know I I walk with a confidence that I didn’t have before In tough times. I know that I’ll find a way to get to get the job done And I don’t let you know performance anxiety or doubt get in the way. Okay, so look at let’s I want to I want to give Some relativity here. Okay, so performance and social anxiety Would you tell the listening audience would you describe what was going on in your life when you first contacted me?

[00:03:06]

Well, I guess specifically I was Experiencing these Very pronounced What I call blackout moments Specifically occurring, you know in stressful work situations and presentations Or meetings where there was a lot of focus on me And I carried into those situations the belief that I had to know everything I had to be the smartest person in the room And I had a handful of what I refer to these blackout moments where the adrenaline rush became so intense that I literally Was blackout for a period of time. It felt like an eternity. It might have been five ten thirty seconds. I don’t know But it was very difficult because it was occurring in front of colleagues and co-workers So that was the the initial Set of issues that caused me to come to you in the first place Yeah, can you describe the actual anxiety that you experienced what it was like?

[00:04:09]

Yeah Leading up to the event You know sometimes hours before sometimes a day’s before depending upon what circumstance was You know, I would have difficulty sleeping difficulty concentrating. I felt a physical effective tightness in my chest shortness and breath and When the event would occur I had built up so much in my mind of you know What the importance of this event was and what failure meant in that situation that I had basically set myself up for a disaster So the actual physical onset of anxiety would occur when I was in those high pressure situations and the best way that I could describe it is you know, it Yeah, I would start into a presentation or start into a discussion and All of a sudden, you know, the walls would start closing in around me It would get you know from the outside end. It would get very dark. I you know, I could feel myself having difficulty breathing and I would start sweating and Before I knew it it just you know, it spiraled I would spiral out of control to the point where I was not able to function and literally had to sit down Okay, and also you there was a lot of family stress going on things in your personal life and You were struggling with some depression and if I remember correctly there were times that you didn’t want to get out of bed Yeah, I you know for both work and personal related reasons

[00:05:52]

You know, there was a period of my life a couple two years back. Let’s say three years back where I had hit, you know a low point that would you know Send me into a depression that was so deep that I just I could not physically give myself up to go face the world and Sometimes that would last for you know a day Sometimes it would last for several days So you have to think anxiety and and if the audience saw you they’d see this Attractive well-built guy in his 40s an athlete a really social guy You’re the type of guy that it’s it’s hard to imagine that a person like you would actually have an anxiety problem When you hear me say that what do you think?

[00:06:45]

Well, I would agree You know in my in my life up until you know the past you know two years I You know, I would agree that I am a pretty social person I have had success throughout my career So, you know if you look at me on paper you would expect that I’m somebody that you know handles these types of situations easily But you know the reality is there’s a lot of stuff that’s going on in my mind or that was going on in my mind that you know caused me to lack confidence and You know ultimately I guess the best way to put it is you know fear situations where I felt like you know It was a career ending type of the situation or a relationship ending type of the situation When in reality, you know, these were all things that were created in my own mind Okay, well I remember the story you told me that On the you know from the not getting out of bed and the depression and the anxiety And I remember the story you told me about on the last something like on the last day of the fiscal year You’re playing golf with your boss and you got a few hundred thousand dollars in bonuses You accomplished a lot and again in such a super super competitive environment now just two more things here a statistical Question on relativity and then a couple of minutes on specifics regarding what you didn’t treatment

[00:08:25]

So on a scale of one to ten if you started at a one and tens perfect Where would you say you’re at and controlling the emotional issues the anxiety and the depression? You know, I’d say I’m at an eight and the reason I would say that is I I don’t believe that I’ll You know, I think we’re always striving to be better, right? I don’t think I’m ever gonna be perfect But I feel like I have gotten myself to a point where I am in control of myself I’m in control of my mind. I’m in control of my body I still face, you know The same types of situations. I still face the same types of pressures, but I’ve got the tools and the mindset to deal with them And so I’m much more confident now in in my in my everyday life both in my You know personal life and in my in my career life, okay now I Happened to work with a lot of very Successful salesman people who have the perfect image in essence a lot of them are superstars And no one would know that I have this anxiety problem But what I’d like you to do for the next two minutes or so is Beyond the testimonial obviously That is what you’re doing here Let’s go beyond it and would you give it your best shot if you were teaching if you have these people in the room Let’s say you had 20 of the salesman who had the same anxiety problem that you had What are the strategies the issues the techniques whatever?

[00:10:00]

What is the most pertinent content that you would want them to know as related to healing? Sure, so first of all, I think you know, you got to start with the basics Understanding what is happening? What what is causing this stress? What are the root causes of? You know your your physical Issues and your mental issues. So as I mentioned earlier kind of understanding getting a handle on the physiology behind what’s causing the performance anxiety But even before that, you know, what are the issues in your life that are triggering these types of events and events and then learning exactly what’s occurring in your mind and from there what? Triggering certain things to happen to your body physically. That’s creating a situation where it is Impossible for you to perform So first and foremost just understanding the physiology and understanding how the mind works and what’s happening there Was important to me so that you can learn how to control it I’d say the other thing that I think is is Critical is to focus on you know changing what you and I refer to as the internal critical script Right so from you know that of people are expecting me to fail Which was my critical script in when we first started working together that you know Everybody’s looking at me waiting for me to do something wrong waiting for me to implode Shifting from that to a critical script of listen. I’m calm. I’m successful

[00:11:40]

I’ve been successful throughout the course of my career. I’m good at what I do. I know what I’m doing I’m supposed to be here. I don’t have to know all the answers and I bring a ton to this equation So that’s kind of the second thing is just making making that shift in your critical script from that of People are expecting me to fail. I’m I’m you know, I am going to fail tool. No, I’m a leader I’m successful and I’m here because I should be here and then I focused a lot on You know or I would suggest focusing a lot on nurturing yourself really recognizing your achievements allowing yourself to recognize that you’re good that you’ve earned the right to be in a position that you’re in and The people are looking to you as an expert, right?

[00:12:30]

It’s there’s nothing wrong with being confident in who you are and you should be confident in who you are Especially if you’ve got a background of success. I think you know one of the most important things though in all of this It’s establishing a healthy baseline and removing any of the things in your life that can You know be obstacles to your success You want to elaborate on that? Yeah, so I was gonna get into it a little bit everything from you know exercising eating right most importantly staying away from substances For me it was alcohol it was painkillers, you know, it was muscle relaxers things that I was using to kind of numb The pain or the fear or the anxiety that I was experiencing You know, it’s it’s something that I monitor very closely. I stay away from substances Those things absolutely have an impact on everything you do So, you know if you’re gonna make take a step toward positive change you’ve got to start with You know physically getting your mind and your body in shape to be successful and that means eating right Getting exercise regularly and you got to get all the substances out of your life Okay, you’re you’re very well organized with your presentation one last clinical question Do you see the relationship?

[00:14:04]

between anger and the emotional problems the anxiety and the depression do you see what you did in restructuring that emotion Yeah, I definitely see the relationship and it’s you know As we first got started. I had a hard time understanding that there was you know an anger component But as I’ve gone through this process, I realized that a lot of these issues are driven from from anger, right and you know anger leads to All of the negative effects that that I’ve experienced so understanding what’s causing this anger where this anger is coming from was really important toward my you know ultimately getting overcoming these these hurdles and these obstacles So when I first brought up the subject of anger it didn’t necessarily make sense But as you went through treatment you got into different levels of consciousness and you understood the relevance that it came from unrealistic expectations of the critical script the excessive critical script and and other sources and really it was the core issue in terms of The the repressed recycling energy that was driving the whole problem Any other words of wisdom that you would share to the listeners?

[00:15:28]

You know don’t don’t be discouraged don’t give up there, you know, there’s definitely a solution There’s definitely a path to success into overcoming These issues that seem so overwhelming You know, I remember early on when we first started working together I had you know, I had tried so many different things and was Starting to believe that this is this is who I am and this is what I’m going to have to deal with in my life And I saw the you know The chain of events unfolding that you know if I’m not able to get this under control You know, I’m not going to be successful in my career. I’m not going to be successful my personal life And and you know through working with you You know, I was able to establish Very early on a sense of confidence that look this is within me. I can do this I can I can work through these issues and I can come out successfully on the other end on the other end I should say You know stay the course do the work You know be dedicated toward it and be committed to Taking whatever steps you need to take in your life to getting healthy And if you do the right things, you know, you follow the plan you’ll get there Anybody can get there. It’s within your control Thank you very much for sharing no problem

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Jonathan Berent, LCSW

Psychotherapist & Author — Social Anxiety and Performance Anxiety

Jonathan Berent, L.C.S.W., A.C.S.W., is a psychotherapist who has been practicing since 1978. He has created the Berent Treatment Method for Social Anxiety, which is the result of his clinical work with thousands of individuals of all ages with social anxiety since 1978. He has extensive clinical experience with avoidance and dependance personality disorder, and is the author of Work Makes Me Nervous: Overcome Anxiety and Build the Confidence to Succeed (Wiley, 2010), Beyond Shyness: How to Conquer Social Anxieties (Simon & Schuster, 1992), and Social Anxiety: The Untold Story, which is a training course for mental health professionals in using the Berent Method to treat social anxiety. (Andrew Kukes Foundation, 2011).

SocialAnxiety.com, has served millions of unique visitors as a multimedia clearinghouse for patients, parents, and fellow mental health professionals in search of articles, educational materials, and books on social anxiety and related subjects. His library of clinical interviews appears to be the most documented clinical success with social anxiety.

Licensed Clinical Social Worker (LCSW)
40+ years in private practice
Author of "Beyond Shyness" and "Work Makes Me Nervous"
Featured on national television and radio
Specialist in performance and social anxiety

Guest Speaker

Frequently Asked Questions

Common Questions About Social Anxiety Treatment

What is performance anxiety?

Performance anxiety occurs when a person experiences excessive anxiety in situations where they believe their performance is being observed or evaluated. It can occur during formal presentations, meetings, interviews, sales calls, public speaking, professional interactions, athletic performance, and other situations involving pressure or scrutiny. The core dynamic for healing is differentiating between “performance” and “personhood”.

How can public speaking anxiety affect your career?

Public speaking anxiety can cause people to avoid presentations, meetings, interviews, leadership opportunities, networking, sales situations, promotions, and other activities important to professional advancement. Someone may possess the knowledge and ability to succeed but find that anxiety prevents them from demonstrating those abilities consistently. The more avoidance takes place the more the individual is susceptible to dysthymia which is a subset of depression.

Can chronic public speaking and social anxiety contribute to depression?

Chronic anxiety can significantly affect quality of life. Repeated avoidance, lost opportunities, isolation, frustration, and the feeling of being unable to overcome the problem can contribute to discouragement, burnout, depressed mood, and dysthymia. When anxiety and depression occur together, both should be considered when developing an appropriate treatment strategy.

What physical symptoms can public speaking anxiety cause?

Public speaking and performance anxiety can cause dissociation, increased pulse, blushing, excessive sweating, trembling, voice changes, stammering, muscle tension, difficulty breathing, mental freezing, dizziness, and panic-like sensations. The fear of experiencing these symptoms in front of other people can itself become a major component of the anxiety.

Why do I get so anxious when speaking in front of people?

Public speaking can trigger the body’s stress response, producing adrenaline and physical sensations such as a racing heart, sweating, blushing, trembling, or difficulty thinking clearly. When a person obsessively worries about the sensations or worries that other people will notice them, the anxiety can intensify and develop into a self-reinforcing cycle.

Take the Next Step

You Do Not Have to Manage This Alone

Public speaking anxiety, performance anxiety, and social anxiety respond to treatment. If this episode described your experience, a conversation is the great next step.